Unknown Number: The High School Catfish

[00:00:19] I don't think you've pressed me well enough to know that the 3, 2, 1, 1 are going to be silent. I know, I literally, I was looking down and I stopped hearing sound and I was like, Oh no, did she drop off? And I look up and you're just like... Have you not watched Wayne's World? Oh my gosh, forever ago. I don't remember anything about it. Your homework now is to watch Wayne's World. Wayne's World. Just the countdown part, yes.

[00:00:49] So welcome to Get Doc! So we are here with Michael Le Profesor, also known as John. Or Juan. He has many names all of a sudden. We have Wilson and our special guest, Ambra. Yeah!

[00:01:17] Back for me, Michael. Clap, clap, clap, clap. Woohoo! Yeah! All right! I get, I finally have someone to gang up on, you know, like to gang up my brother with... Yeah, I'm going to get to gang up on. I finally have someone to help me gank... Yes. There you go. She can't speak. I still can't speak. That's a common thing. Just trip over everyone. Well, this is the perfect thing to do when you can't speak is podcasting. Podcasting, yes.

[00:01:47] So today we are going to discuss Unknown Number. What is it? The High School Catfish? Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, it had some sort of subtitle that I did not commit to memory. I believe it is. It's the High School Catfish. It's the High School Catfish. Yeah. Yes. Available on Netflix. It made quite the impression when it first came out. I got an immediate text from Ambra.

[00:02:17] It was like a year ago. It was like a year ago. Did you watch this? It was last year ago. It's last year. Yes. I was like, who can I... It's one of those things that I'm like, who can I talk to about this? Because this is crazy. And I was like, you do documentaries, so it has to be you. So here we go. Let's take it. Take it, Mikey. So let's set the scene. Or not.

[00:02:47] It's October. Okay, there we go. Dramatic pause. This takes place in a place called Beale City, Michigan. This is where your son gets those movie trailers from. It's you. He got it from you. I mean, do you want me to set the scene? We were the team. You learned it from watching you, dad. Beale City, Michigan. Yeah, set it. Set it. In a world.

[00:03:15] Apparently, by all accounts, and by all accounts, I mean just this one documentary that I saw. Beale City is just like a small town. There's one high school there that everyone goes to. I think they even mentioned at one point, it's literally like K through 12 and like the same school. So it's not very big. There's like 700 people in the high school for the whole city. Everybody kind of knows each other.

[00:03:45] There's like anything that happens there. Everyone's going to kind of know what's going on. Like there's no. It's small town lights. I don't know. So then I think the first person we hear speak is Lauren and she's the. I guess the central figure in all of this.

[00:04:06] So we meet Lauren and what they're talking about initially is this Halloween party that's kind of this ramping up. And. She's been dating this guy named that one for a year. And then suddenly they get like this text from. Where do you think it came from? An unknown number. An unknown number.

[00:04:35] An unknown number. Like the title of the documentary. So this text from an unknown number. I don't remember exactly what it said, but. The common theme in all of these. There were so many text messages. Well, later on. When. They like give these text messages over to like federal authorities. I think they said it was over 700 pages of text.

[00:05:06] That happened. I think in a span of like 18 months or so. Texting away. Um. And. And can we just like say that I feel like that's like a full time job. Well. Turns out it is. We'll get to that later. Um. Because. It's. Anyway, that's crazy. Um. But they get this. This text. I don't remember exactly what the first text said. Maybe not super important.

[00:05:36] But it's just kind of out of the blue. And it starts like two weeks before this Halloween party. Um. Wasn't it like. I think it's trying to like break. Your boyfriend's going to break up with you. It was like hateful towards their relationship. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Who. Who. Who. I guess. During this time. During this year that they're dating. They're like. I think they're freshmen. In high school at this time. But they're like.

[00:06:06] The golden couple. Or like. They're the one that everyone thinks is going to be together forever. Um. And so. And because it's a small town. Everybody knows them. But I guess. That could lead to jealousy. Uh. Especially if. Other. People. Are interested in Owen. Um. So yeah. Trying to break up. Um.

[00:06:35] And then I think it says that. After. Like. The text stopped. Completely after that. But then they pick up again. Eleven months later. Eleven months after the first text. And then it starts again. Uh huh. And. These texts specifically start calling Lauren by her nickname. So. That indicates. At least to Lauren. That. It's someone that. You're close to. It's kind of like. There's some familiarity there. Right. Um.

[00:07:06] And so that's kind of like the. Initial backdrop. Where things are going on. And it. It does. The dog. Kind of backtracks at this point. And we kind of. Get the beginning of how Lauren and Owen met. They met in seventh grade. They're both at the sports. They seem like perfect for each other. Or whatever. Um. But then these texts start happening. Their families are intertwined. Yeah. Um. Everyone. Wasn't it Owen's mom. That even said like. Their lives were kind of like. A.

[00:07:36] Like. A movie. High school movie. Or not. Well no. It just cut out. What did you say? What did you say? You cut out for a second. Sorry. I said. I said. I said that. Um. Wasn't it his mother. Owen's mom. That had mentioned that. Like. Them being together. And dating. It was almost like a high school movie. Yeah. Yeah. Like people thought. Yeah. Mm hmm. Sorry. Poor.

[00:08:06] Poor you. You were like. Hello. I was like. I watched the wrong documentary apparently. No. You did it. You just cut out. You just stared at me blankly. And I was like. Oh. Oh my gosh. Okay. But then. Owen. Owen mentioned something that. At least talking about like boys. Like he's pretty. He seems pretty certain that it's not one of the boys.

[00:08:36] Because. At least in that town. They're not the one. Boys don't. They like drama. I don't really care about that. They just want to play sports and do whatever. Do. Boy things. Um. And I think everyone just kind of. It's. All the assumption that it's probably a girl. Um. But they don't know who. Cause it's another number. Well from the text messages. You would think. That's your first. First thought that it's. You know. Female. Because they're talking about.

[00:09:06] He wants me. Right. And they're putting down Lauren. Yeah. In every possible way. Like. Saying. The worst things. Anybody could ever say. To a girl. That age. Especially. So it feels very like. Only another girl would do that. You know. Like only another girl. Especially if it's like. Trying to break up. A relationship and stuff. Yeah. They're attacking. They're attacking. Yeah. Yeah. And there's. They're attacking her personality. But.

[00:09:36] Everything. Yeah. Not just. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's getting text message. Text messages. Separately as well. Um. All from this unknown number. So. No. It's Michael. And again. We don't know. But it's. They mentioned. It's like 30, 40, 50 texts a day. Yeah. Some of them seem kind of long. And they're kind of. We missed all of that Mikey. Yeah. Our internet did something weird. Sorry.

[00:10:05] You're going to have to repeat that my love. From where? So start from the very beginning. So let me. So it takes place in Michigan. No. I'm just kidding. It takes place in Michigan. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. I'm just kidding. No. You were talking about Owen. No. You were talking about Owen also getting text messages. Yeah. Owen's also getting texts. There was one stoplight. There was two bars. The one traffic signal they showed. It wasn't.

[00:10:34] It didn't even seem like a full light. It was like. Intermittently yellow. Like permanently. It's like. Just a. Yeah. You have to yield. That's all you get. So. But it's. They're pretty intense. They're getting like 30, 40, 50 texts a day. And they're pretty like. They start out pretty intense. But I feel like as it's going on. They're getting even more and more intense. So it gets to the point where Owen tells his parents. And so.

[00:11:05] The parents. And pause for a second. Yes. Okay. So the text messages. I mean. We're not just talking like daytime. Like they go well into the night. Like. Early, early in the morning. And they're not just like insulting and stuff like that. Like they're like some. They're like nasty. Some of the text messages. Like I was like. Looking around to see if the kids were around. Cause I was like. Oh my gosh. They're like reading these text messages. And they're gross.

[00:11:36] Yeah. It's. It's. Yeah. Like real. Very quickly. Like they. They get real. Super sexual. Super graphic. Yeah. That you would not expect. Maybe a 13 year old to be using at that time. In the way that they were using them in the text message. For sure. Especially small town. Like I don't know. I've never really lived in a small town like that. But like. You just think like small town people. Like I don't know.

[00:12:06] They're not going to be. Like a small town. 13, 14 year old girl. Isn't going to be saying the things. And side note. So. Like not true. No, no, no, no. Side note on the small town. They still have more stuff than I do where I live. So just saying that. Not so much. They have a Papa Murphy. Well. Yeah. You're pretty. That's part of the issue with.

[00:12:35] Not to make it very like abstract. But part of this is only made possible because of the level of technology. Available now. And the level of technology available to the kids. So. Something like this. May have happened 20 years ago. But it would have looked very different. Than just like the constant texts where you have like a direct ladder communication. With kids and kids having a direct ladder communication with each other.

[00:13:05] In this way. So it seems like something like that. Because back in the day you hit that 300 text limit. You're going to. It's going to start charging. It's going to add up. Yeah. Never happened. That's why you had unlimited. Yeah. Remember you had unlimited only from a certain time to another certain time. So it wouldn't have been all day. It would have been in that little few hours. That little window of time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. So Michael you're saying. Yeah. I think they made it kind of clear.

[00:13:36] I was going to say they made it kind of clear on the documentary that a lot of the people basically just lived online. With their, you know, and on their phones all the time. And even the, I think it was the principal was like, oh, I do all my stuff on my phone. So, you know, that's all my productivity and everything else like that goes through. Yeah. Because one of the, one of the solutions that I think they were tossing around, I don't know if this was this, we're talking about like a cell phone man in school or something.

[00:14:04] And that's where it was either the principal or super 10. I was saying like, I mean, we can ban it, but I do everything. Like I keep my schedule on there. It's like a productivity thing. It's, it's, it is a tool that can help. However, it is something that you have to exercise good judgment with. So of course, teenagers are going to exercise good judgment when using it. What?

[00:14:33] Do they, Michael? Do they? I have personal experience. Yes, they do. At all times. At all times. At all times. But. It. Yeah. So I want to reach in the breaking point. He tells his parents, the parents want the school to do something. And they kind of, I mean, they, they start. As far as like what the school does.

[00:15:03] I feel like. They. They kind of handle it pretty appropriately. I mean, they kind of, they try and get information. Then they try and do more than that. Don't worry. They try and find another solution. That doesn't work. They get other people. They try and do more than that. They try and do more than that. And they try and do more than that. And they try to coordinate when Lauren's getting these text messages. And they try to kind of see who's like on their phone during that time. But that doesn't.

[00:15:31] Isn't really super productive because it's hard to tell what they're doing, what the kids are doing on the phone. If they're just watching videos, if they're texting or something else. They recommend potentially blocking the number or changing the kids numbers, but they don't seem to do that at all. They don't want to block the number because the parents, I guess, are. Well. I guess block the number because they do want to like track it down eventually, but it's not even like a true.

[00:16:01] They're worried that if they do deduce that they might lose who it is and be worried of an attack later on. However, all the other argument is if they block the number and it's someone within the friend group, they're just going to get the other number. Right. And same thing. It's not a solution. It's not. Yeah. Right. I mean, I've had to change my number. It's a band-aid, but it's not, it's not going to actually fix the problem because the

[00:16:30] person's still going to be able to reach out. Yeah. I mean, I had a situation where I was being harassed on, you know, via my phone and I changed my number. It didn't help at all. It didn't help. They just found it again. I didn't know who it was. And they just, if they want to find you, they'll find you. Changing or blocking a number doesn't help, especially with all these new apps. I've blocked people plenty of times that are harassing me and they just get another number

[00:16:59] via another app and keep sending you messages. There's way to bypass everything nowadays. Oh, the life of the unemployed. I tell you, you just have way too much. People just have way too much time on their hands. Like, oh goodness. So then, so then 13 months. I think that was also like, oh yeah. Okay. No, no.

[00:17:27] I was just going to say, I was going to make a reference to the, the months, but you just, you're, you're starting off on that one. So we're good. Well, 13 months after the first message. They get to the point where it's gotten to be too much. So Lauren and Owen eventually break up.

[00:17:46] And then this is where the text messages start telling her to kill herself, which is. I like how we're all just like depressed. We're like, yeah, this is bad. We already know the ending. So we know where it's going. And it's like, I watched it again. And it was like a very different experience.

[00:18:16] Watching it again, since you already know the ending and it's like. It is one of the few documentaries that I would suggest people watch multiple times, at least twice. At least twice. Because it is exactly what you said, a different viewing experience each time you watch it the first time and you're like. And the second time you're just looking for stuff because you know what the ending is.

[00:18:41] You're just looking, you're dissecting like behaviors from people and just trying to read the room. Yeah. Hundred percent. How many times did you watch it, Wilson? Did you? Twice. Yes. I saw it twice. Yeah. It was, it was definitely. Yeah. Not great.

[00:19:11] But yeah. Well, you know, when, when kids talk to kids and they say horrible stuff, you're kind of anticipating, but it's not really like, you know, they really mean it. You know, it just, you know, horrible stuff that you say. But yeah, when we actually all find out that it's like, Oh my God. Are we going to spoil the ending? But when we talk about it later? No, no, no. No.

[00:19:39] But I'm trying so hard not to spoil it. Trying so hard on month. Yeah. On month 15. That's when the officer main shows up and is notified about the stuff that's going on. And, um, I think that's when, uh, they start turning over like the phones and people search hurling accusations at each other. And they start actually doing like an actual real investigation. Right.

[00:20:07] And this is when we get like our first real suspects. Kind of come through. Yeah. Who's Chloe. That poor girl. And I guess. I just. Chloe. Not exactly well liked. No. You find out who your friends are when people start hurling accusations. You do. Ma'am.

[00:20:31] Um, well, one of the things that the sheriff was looking for, he was looking specifically for like a close knit friend group. One that would be able to keep a secret. Technical difficulties. Together. I'm telling you, he's in the basement. He, he should be. I don't know, babe. The basement is not. You want to bring your computer to the bedroom or something? Can you hear me now? I think what they were trying to do is they were, they were doing the investigation. I think that. Okay.

[00:21:01] Yeah. You're just like super delayed too though. Oh, great. You get, you get a point towards the east and put tinfoil on your. On your. Something. It's like the weather and I'm in the basement. Anyway. Um, so. Should I start from where? What was the last thing you heard? Nothing. Babe, the basement is not. Wilson, go ahead. Say something.

[00:21:31] Go for it, Wilson. Go for it, Wilson. All right. I got this. Okay. So basically on. But. Let's do this one more time. One more. All right. Try it. Give me, give me one more time. Let's go. Let's do this. Oh, I was literally going. I thought Wilson was going to go.

[00:22:02] You said give yourself one more time. Oh, I just wanted to do a hug. That's all. Longest. All right. Go Wilson. Go. Wilson. Come on. Wilson. You go. Okay. Take it. Take it. Okay. So month. Month 15. Officer Maine gets involved. Actually starts talking to the parents, starts talking to the school to see what they've

[00:22:32] already done in their investigation and starts going through like some of the phones and text messages and stuff like that. Obviously, their resources are incredibly limited. So, you know, they get to a certain point where not really much ground has been covered past what the assumptions are for most of the people. So parents started getting frustrated and then they started going back to the school

[00:23:00] and they started getting mad and they actually wanted to start going from classroom to classroom actually talking to some of these people. And of course, the superintendent and the principal had to get involved and say we can't do that and everything was kind of going back and forth. And I think all the parents were frustrated like Lauren's mom's in the office with Owen's mom talking about like you guys aren't doing enough. How are you know what's going on? So yeah, there's a lot of parental anger at what's going on. Okay.

[00:23:29] Keyword, all of them. And then also the parents of like the kids were getting accused also getting upset. Like it's everything. So. And I think what Michael was trying to say earlier, you were trying to talk about the officers assumption that it was a group of people that were probably harassing Lauren. He was, he was looking for like a close knit friend group.

[00:23:55] And so when he found Chloe, Chloe's friends with Sophie and Macy. So that kind of fit what they were looking for. And there was, I guess, sort of background history with Chloe and Lauren. They didn't. I don't know that they hated each other. They didn't really get along. And it seemed like she wasn't close with Owen at one point, but once Owen and Lauren started dating like their, whatever friendship, relationship, whatever.

[00:24:23] There was some sort of triangle there. It seemed that Chloe might've had a crush on Owen and they kind of hung out a lot. And then Lauren's like, I don't like her. She's trying to get with Owen, you know, that high school drama nonsense. Right. Where you're just hanging out with a member of the opposite sex. I don't think Chloe really hated Lauren. Yeah. But it doesn't look like Chloe really hated Lauren. She was just like, eh, she was there, whatever.

[00:24:53] And then Lauren's like, I hated her. Well, they definitely weren't friends though. In that regard. No, no. But. Yeah. And I mean, I mean like not to be, but. I think it was easy for them to turn to her because I think the group of them did have maybe like a tiny bit of a reputation of not necessarily being like super friendly

[00:25:20] and welcoming and they did kind of bullying tendencies. Yeah. So I think it was kind of easy to be like, here's this girl that we don't really get along and you're, there's a group of them. And I mean. She has a history of being mean. Yeah. I mean, there's definitely like mean girl vibes with that group. So I mean, I, I, it's unfortunate that they were accused. She was accused, but I mean, again, like she didn't do herself any favors leading up

[00:25:49] to this with like some of her past behaviors and stuff like that. Yeah. It just looks like a pattern of behavior that's now just escalated. Which. Yeah. Yeah. It's unfortunate. But that was a big escalation real fast from zero to 90. Yeah. Me and girls do like explicit language. Like I still feel like I'm like, are you sure about that? Yeah. Yeah. Oh goodness.

[00:26:19] And I mean, there's another suspect to talk about during the center to Adriana, who's like Owen's cousin and they make it seem like it might be her because of this one picture. She, that was taken during like a Christmas party that only felt like a family member or someone close would have taken. And they think it's her because Chloe and her friend group allegedly bullied Adriana.

[00:26:44] And so she's setting up Chloe as the fall person in this situation. Like it's a whole, it's like real complicated explanation, but it ain't any of them. Well, and I think that when the person was actually sending the anonymous messages, she was also referencing Chloe in the messages or like talking like she was Chloe in the messages. And I kind of threw, yeah.

[00:27:13] And it was like, it was a whole bunch of red flies. Like you wouldn't go through the trouble of trying to be anonymous while referencing yourself. Well, and then there's the other part where like, oh, we went on vacation to Florida and suddenly the numbers start having like a Florida area code. Like. Which is easy to do with an app. The amount of work. It's easy to do. I mean, this is just crazy. All right.

[00:27:36] So I guess we could take a little pause here so that we can, you know, take a quick break and then we'll come back and maybe spoil who it is. Finally. Because we're all dancing around it. What? Listen, this came out in August of last year. If, if, I mean, if they don't know. We also got to bring in the FBI on. That's right. What is it? Month 17. Month 18. 17. 18, yeah. 17.

[00:28:06] 17 or 18. It's right now. Right. Yeah. Bradley or something, Peters? All right. So we'll be back. Break. And welcome to get docked. Oh, God damn. Whoa, whoa, whoa. What were you going to say? See? Oh my God. The proof we need. That's why you botch it all the time. No, no, no.

[00:28:35] I said, I said welcome to get docked. Because you thought we were, you were like doing the intro for the beginning of the episode. And you were expecting this. But we're just back from like a break. All right. This is the second part of the same episode. We're trying to get. We're trying to get. No, we're not. Five. You can't cut this. No, I'm cutting it. Five. Five. Four. Three. Okay, look. And we are back. And the things were Betty White. Fuck, fuck, fuck.

[00:29:06] See you guys. All right. Anyway. We are back. We are back. Poor Daphne. You're going to be spending so much time editing this episode. We're back. We're back. We've been back. We've been back. We're back with Wilson. We've got Michael's special guest, Ambra. And we are discussing unknown number, the high school captain. They didn't forget about us. It was just a break.

[00:29:32] You think they're pausing the episode and then like doing tours for like two days? I've had comments from people asking me to do that. Thank you. I like the refreshing of the memories. I like that. I've had specific comments. Well, get ready for me to refresh who I am. I'm every five minutes in. Okay, Juan. If you want to be refreshed, get ready.

[00:29:59] It sounds like you need to refresh people because you got a new nickname this weekend, John. I'm going to introduce myself with a different name every single time so no one's going to know who I am. Okay. Oh my gosh. Okay, Professor John. Okay, we're back for real now. This is John speaking. Yes. John speaking. No, 18 months after the return. Not the return.

[00:30:28] What are we talking about? I'm all confused. The revenge. So, 18 months later when the new Avatar movie comes out. Um... And now he's first. He laughed too hard. He broke the signal. I'm ready. So, I guess I'll do it. Okay.

[00:30:58] Okay. Okay. 18 months into this. Now, uh... The FBI steps in. Uh... The police officer contacts the FBI. Gives him what he has as far as, uh... The, uh... His investigation goes. And then the other guy, the FBI guy, starts actually issuing subpoenas, uh... To, like, the cell phone companies. And starts getting IP addresses. And all that good stuff.

[00:31:27] And, you know, goes over some of the investigations again. That the, uh... Police officer did. And that's when the fun stuff starts happening. Yes. With the search warrants, they are able to get all of the information, uh... In regards to the text messaging, the numbers, the IP numbers. Uh... Yeah. So, they get the IP addresses. And they're able to match them with certain numbers. And then the missing number keeps on popping up.

[00:31:57] So, they ask, uh... Owen's parents. They ask them, they're like, hey, give us the phone number you have of all the kids that don't knows. And we'll see if we can get a match. Nothing matches. And then they just start feeding them any number that they have. Because now they're kind of expanding outside of it being a kid. And so, they eventually get a match. Okay, spoiler alert. If you haven't seen it, this is the time to turn this off. If you're gonna watch it and you don't want it to be spoiled. Hold on.

[00:32:27] You have to say who you are and then say spoiler. Oh, right. Amara. Amara. This is Amara speaking. So, the match... Should I say it? Go for it. I know you want to say it. You want to say it. Go for it. I want to say it. Do you remember her name? I was just thinking, but what the heck is it? I have her name written down. Okay, well, listen. I can just tell you. The match comes back.

[00:32:54] And it comes back to Lauren's skank-ass mother. Kendra. Kendra LaCarrie. Isn't it like, tell me how you really feel. Kendra. Kendra LaCarrie. Okay. Um, which is insane. Like, insane.

[00:33:18] So, to refresh everyone's memory, since you might have been gone for a few weeks in between the first part and now. Um, so, all the text messages talking about how ugly Lauren is and how, like, that they should break up and that Owen's too good for her and all the sexually explicit text messages and to kill herself. There you go. All of that came from her mother, who, to be fair, looks a little like Quasimodo.

[00:33:48] Like, I'm going to be honest. So, I'm like, whoa. I mean, ma'am. That's not an inaccurate description. It's not an inaccurate description. It's really not. Um, anyway. So, yeah. That's, I don't even know. It's insane. Like. Well, and everybody was shocked. Except Lauren. Well. Lauren seemed the most out of shock. She was just like, oh. Yeah, okay.

[00:34:17] Well, I think she was, like, in disbelief and kind of in denial. Well, remember. Just like in the beginning of the documentary. She has been going around. I wonder who this is. Where are we with the investigation? You're not doing enough. What are you doing? My poor daughter. That's what kills me. Her going to the school and being like, you're not doing enough to stop this from happening.

[00:34:48] But I wonder now. What kills me is that she sat on that documentary for a full 45 minutes talking about it was so troubling for all of us. We all were suffering. I was so upset. I felt so bad for Lauren. And it was her. What? Like, is she insane? Or is she, like, the greatest actress of all time? Or both? I mean. She just fails to take any kind of responsibility for anything that she's doing.

[00:35:17] And she automatically, like, comes up with this other persona where she feels like it wasn't really her. And all this other stuff was happening in her life. And yada, yada, yada. And it was somebody else's fault. But technically it was me. But I wasn't in the right headspace. Oh, my gosh. It wasn't me. But it was. Meanwhile, she's telling her daughter to kill herself. But I didn't start it. But it was. I think that was confirmed, right?

[00:35:46] So the first messages that came in in October of 2020 was not from her. And then I guess that gave her the idea to do that? Like, is that what we're supposed to believe? So I don't think it was confirmed by anybody except for her. Well, then. She claimed. She claimed. Well, she claimed. Well, I just started sending messages because I was fishing for information.

[00:36:11] I figured, like, if I could get them talking to each other, then maybe, like, I could get a clue and investigate on my own. And. And. Well, she should have been doing was paying attention to her damn job. Right. Correct. This was her job. This was her only job. She worked this job 24-7. She claimed to have had two jobs at the time, was telling her mommy that she was working and this is what she was doing with her time. Because she got.

[00:36:41] She got. Well, she said she quit. But she got laid off. But then another thing, too. At both jobs. Another thing that I feel like is weird and maybe, I mean, I realize we all have different lives. But, like, if Michael was like, yeah, I'm working. I'm going to know if he's not because the checks aren't going to be hitting the bank. Like, how do you not know? She was controlling the finances. Like, they made. So he doesn't log in to online banking at all? He was just letting her handle.

[00:37:11] Because remember, he even mentioned, like, she was handling everything. And then all of a sudden I found out we, like, we lost this. We lost that. We threw our stuff in a storage unit. And we lost the storage unit. Yeah, he wasn't paying attention. He was just working. Well. Crazy. It also went through the fact that she filed an insurance claim on the house that was fraudulent to get more money. So I guess she can keep the stream running for whatever she was doing in the background.

[00:37:39] So she can actually still show that she was making money. See, all these extra problems on the side make me feel like she started the whole text message. Well, and here's the thing. The cop says. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. The sheriff, he says he doesn't believe her when he says that because they never found, like, another number associated with those early ones. So the story that she comes up with, that she wasn't the first one. It just felt weird.

[00:38:05] It just felt weird to me that you're admitting to doing all of this. And, like, the worst texts were the ones that were later on that she was sending. But then you're not admitting to doing, like, the handful that came in October. You know what I mean? It just feels like a weird thing to be like, that one wasn't me. But all the ones where I told her to kill herself and everything, that was me. Like, what? Well, that's totally me. Totally. She lacks normal human reasoning.

[00:38:34] And I think this is her way of trying to deflect in some way. Like, like. It's not as bad as you guys think. I was just trying to stir the pot to get information. So I had to tell her to kill herself. So she'd go talk to her friends. Well, and then she was. I think someone off camera asked her, like, how did that make you feel? And she was like, oh, I thought she could handle it. She'd be fine. Like, what?

[00:39:03] Well, I think when they started asking some of the other people, they were putting her in a situation where she was saying horrible stuff to her daughter to get her daughter to come home and confide in her to actually, like, strengthen their relationship. But she was basically the one who was telling her to kill herself. So I'm like, you know. Disgusting. There's a lot of. Get a job, Barbara. Get a job. There's a lot of theories about why she might have done this. I think, like, the school superintendents says it might have been, like, cyber munch houses. Like, she just wants to be a set of attention.

[00:39:33] And this is a way for her to inject herself in, like, the investigation and everything. After doing my full analysis, I have the result for that, actually. Because it just turns out that she's just incredibly bored. She's bored of life. That is just the technical.

[00:39:59] Owen and her mom think that she's, like, into Owen as well. Like, they go on, like, this whole. Okay, can I? That's something else. That's something else that made me really uncomfortable is that, and again, this is total speculation. No one will ever know unless she says that this is true. It's giving a little, I'm into Owen, even though I'm a grown adult.

[00:40:23] If you do a deep dive on Google and watch interviews after this documentary where she's talking and other people are talking, that apparently was most definitely the case. Her attraction or interactions with Owen are much worse than what the documentary went on. Yeah. Yeah. Like, if I was Owen's mom, I would be like, okay, I need to file charges because this woman wants my teenage son. Like, you know? Yeah. It's crazy. I think Owen. Is there. Go ahead, Wilson.

[00:40:54] Is there a room in the house that has, like, photo cutouts of them together? Oh, my gosh. There might be. There might be. There's little strings everywhere. It's like a little. It's pictures of Owen and Lauren together, but she's cut out her face and put it there instead of Lauren. Just stuck it on Lauren's face. Right. Gosh. Yeah. Like, you know, little newspaper cutouts and everything else like that, just full documenting his life. It's, yeah. That part of it was because some of the text messages were like.

[00:41:24] Well. Were framed in such a way that, like, Owen would be better off with her, the texter, and that, like, Lauren didn't even know what to do. Like, and I'm just like, look, that's, that's. And knowing it's her mom. Here's one of the things that. Wait, can you do that again? I forgot to. Here's one of the things we forgot to mention before. At one point, Owen goes on, like, summer vacation to, like, another city. I think it's, like, Pinecoding or Pinkoning.

[00:41:53] And he meets another girl. Yeah. And he starts dating. Yes. Another unknown number starts texting, like, that other girl's mom. Right. So that, that kind of leads even more to the fact that. It's more about Owen. It's more about Owen, not her daughter, necessarily. It leads more to the fact that it's about Owen, right? Oh, and don't forget the fact that when he was, when he was over for dinner, she would cut his steak for him.

[00:42:22] And she would chew it. No. And then just feed it to him like a baby bird. Like a baby bird. Little baby bird. Baby bird. Oh, Lord. Yeah, I think that's, like, there's so many things. I mean, just because it's her daughter and the stuff that she was saying. And then the whole, like, Owen thing and being a teenager. Like, there's just, and then the whole thing with the financial situation at home.

[00:42:49] Like, I just, there's, in every single way, she just kept doing the worst. Like, I don't understand. There's so much better stuff you could be doing with your time. And she literally ruined everybody's life, including her own. Well, it's not only that there's so much better stuff that you could be doing. Like, it would literally be better to do nothing. Like, nothing is better than what you did. And doing nothing takes less effort than what you did.

[00:43:19] But he still chose to do this. And dedicate, I mean, she even said she would spend, like, up to eight hours a day doing this sometimes. Oh, and not to mention, like, her husband, who basically lost almost everything he had and worked for his entire life. Yeah. Because they had to put stuff in storage. And then they didn't have the amount of money to cover the storage. So then they just lost everything. But less. Yes.

[00:43:47] And then he, you know, when they confront her about, like, her lying about the work and everything else like that, you know, she didn't really have any response. So she basically had been lying to everybody for about a year now. Yep. So let's talk about the awkwardness when the cops come in and they have to call her husband to come home. That whole scene was so awkward. Oh, my God. I wanted to just, like, spontaneously combust.

[00:44:14] Because, like, you have Lauren, and I know she's a teenager, but she just was, like, I don't know. I mean, obviously I've never been in that situation. But I just feel like that her, she was so, it's almost like she wasn't shocked. So to me it made it seem like, did she have a suspicion? And if she did, I don't know. You know what I mean? Like, her reaction, like, didn't happen.

[00:44:39] The reactions were underwhelming because I feel like, number one, if my mom had done that to me and then, like, you know, the father was like, you have to leave. And she's, and the mom's then hugging on me going, I can't leave her. She needs me now. I'd be like, gross, get off of me. Look at everything you just did. And she's just sitting there, like, letting her mom hug her. It was a weird reaction. But even his reaction was underwhelming.

[00:45:10] Like, he didn't scream. He didn't, like, not even like, what the F were you doing? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, he was just like, you need to leave. I'm calling your parents to come pick you up. What? And on all fronts, right? Like, I would, you think about the financial stuff and everything he's losing in that way. But then knowing what she was doing to your guys' daughter, like, I mean, that would have sent me into, like, a rage. Like, I wouldn't, you know what I mean? And I know everybody reacts to things differently.

[00:45:37] But I just felt like that whole part, I'm like, I don't know. It just, it felt weird. Weirdly calm. Weirdly calm, the two of them. Yeah. And then her waterworks was just, it was too much. The crocodile tears. Well, I think after a while, like, people were assuming things. And I think, yes, that was just a confirmation that, you know, that's why I don't think the reactions were as bad as they should have been.

[00:46:06] Because I think deep down, everybody kind of started figuring out that, you know, this is probably what's going to happen. And then when the police showed up at the door, they're like, okay, this is definitely what happened. There's one couple that thought it. And they made it clear. They made it perfectly clear. They think the three of them knew. Those were Chloe's parents. Yes, Chloe's parents. Yeah. And her dad is a cop, too. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, Chloe's dead.

[00:46:32] And they insinuated, they insinuated that they believe that the father and the daughter at some point figured it out. And they just kind of, like, manipulated the situation to be the victims. Yeah, that's kind of what, I mean, I don't know. It's weird. But, like, I just felt like it's one thing if Lauren is just, like, shocked and in disbelief and can't believe it. Okay, then sure, I can.

[00:46:59] But then the husband's reaction being just as, like, it just felt weird that everybody was so, like, okay, thanks for telling us. You know what I mean? Like, what? Like, I was expecting, like, a big blow up. Like, somebody to have some big reaction. Level of volume up at least once. Be like, what? What? Or even, or even, Lauren, someone to walk away. I don't want to talk to you. I can't look at you right now.

[00:47:29] Something. But, like, nothing happened. Everyone, literally, they all were just like, oh, okay. Wow. All right. And I was like, why am I more mad than you guys? Like, what? Maybe it's just a Michigan thing. Then again, if she had been lying to her husband about so many things and the financial stuff. Like, at which point do you think he's just a broken man and just be like, okay, this is another thing. This is just a Tuesday in my house.

[00:47:59] Just a regular Tuesday. It's just, you know, there's that argument, too. Like, we don't know everything she's done to him. Like, we know about the financial stuff. But we don't know about what other stuff she may have been lying to him about. Other things she may have been doing throughout their marriage. So it could have just been a, oh, it's just another Tuesday. Of course. Or it's just like a relief. Like, yes, I can finally get her out of my life. It could be that, too.

[00:48:29] Like, now this, I can divorce her over this. I'm calling your parents. They can pick you up and you can show yourself the door. Listen, he was ready with that phone, too. He did say, let me, I'm dialing them right now. He had them on speed dial. He just moonwalks out the house. He sure did. He was like, woo, done. Yeah. But so, like, I kind of, like, I don't know if I think that they were a part of it.

[00:48:57] Like, they knew at some point. Or if this was, like, a complete shock and it was just, like, the last straw. Like, of course it's her. Just get her out. So I don't know where I land on that because I kind of go back and forth. And I've rewatched it, like, three or four times. And I'm different opinion every time I watch it. Uh-huh. Maybe it's just, I don't know.

[00:49:25] I feel like I typically take more things that face value. Like, I'm okay with believing that Lauren and Sean didn't know. But he knew about the other phone. Well, yeah. Because Lynn's, like, a work phone and her personal phone. So he thought she had a work phone and a personal phone. Work phone? Her work. Work. You mean her stalking her own daughter phone? Yeah.

[00:49:53] So if she claimed it was a work phone, do you think she was ever sitting, like, next to him while she's, like, go kill yourself? A hundred percent. I was just thinking that. You, she, the amount of text messages that came through all day. Lauren was probably in the house crying about the text she just got while her mom's, like, uh-huh, uh-huh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Hold on, I'm just sending a quick text. Like, it's probably, she's probably texting her while they're talking about it. Yeah. Like, look, mom, here's another that just came through. That would be a little too suspicious.

[00:50:21] But I'm sure she could schedule some of these things as well. Like, it's not. Well, she was going through an app. Oh, wow. Right. So. But I think it was also the voice that Daphne used. What voice did I? Like, kill yourself. Kill yourself. Well, it's fine. They use, like, a distorted voice when they read these text messages in the documentary. I hate it so much. That's so creepy. Oh, yeah. I hate it so much.

[00:50:51] Like, you should kill yourself. It's the, uh, like, the jigsaw voice. It's like a knockoff ghost face voice. No, it's like, it's the, uh, the jigsaw, like, uh, do you want to play a game? Yeah, do you want to play a game? I have Owen in my basement. Chain to the wall. I've managed to get him out of my. That's a whole nother movie. Yeah. I don't know.

[00:51:19] I just feel like it's, it's just like, I don't know. It's, it's sad. Should we break? It's sad and then do final thoughts? And it's unfortunate. Yeah. Yeah. So let's take a break. We'll come back with our final thoughts. Final thoughts. Final depressed thoughts. Yes. And, uh, we'll be back.

[00:51:53] And we are back. I'm not going to introduce everybody. What? Wow. There you go. Yeah. Do it. Wow. Wow. Add a little echo to it. Wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. I will introduce everybody because according to a professor, everybody should know who we are. I mean, don't you? I mean, we can do a roll call. That's fine. Roll call. Oh my God. You know what? You should just be John Juan. John Juan. There you go. John.

[00:52:23] What a redundant, silly name. Just kidding. If anyone's name is John Juan, I think it's great. I think it's great. That sounds very close to like John Juan. That is terrible. Yeah. Exactly. Except you're John Juan. There you go. I'm down for that. You're officially John Juan. Michael John Juan Carlos Castron. Yes. Okay. I'm not calling for that. That's a lot.

[00:52:55] El profesor Michael John Juan Carlos Castron. Oh, wow. Yes. De Arellano. I'm digging it. I'm digging it. You can just keep on getting longer and longer. Please don't say that. You need to be like Picasso where he's got like 13 names. Yes. You know, and he's just this long string. All right. So we're back. Are we officially back? We're back. Yes, we're back.

[00:53:24] We're still talking about Unknown Number. The High School Catfish. Is that taken away, Wilson? Now we know. Uh-huh. Now we know. We know. It was the ball. So taken away, Wilson, you were saying during the break, you mentioned. I mentioned that it was kind of curious that she got charged for felony stalking, but she never actually got charged for being a weird, creepy pedo. And she definitely should. And I thought that was kind of weird. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:53:52] I'm pretty sure there's a room in that house that just has like cutouts and little photos and like things that he threw away in trash cans that she put in like a little plastic bag. Hair clippings? She probably sniffs at night. Yeah. You know, like. Owen's first haircut. Yeah. You know, like. Toe nail clippings. Just like anything. Oh, okay. But yes, I agree. She just glues like hair clippings and wears them as wigs and stuff like that and walks around But I guess that would. No, I told.

[00:54:22] That would depend on the definition of, I guess, pedophilia. Like, did she physically do anything to him? She sent. Yeah. A lot of stuff via text messaging and said a lot of gross stuff. But how much of that could be considered actual. Actually under that, whatever this law is. Actually, I'm going to stop myself because I opened up a Google browser and I was like, what is the definition of a pedophile? But then I was like, you know what?

[00:54:52] Let me not. Because I actually. That's a horrible idea. I actually don't want the FBI to come to my house today. So I'm actually not going to search that. But I did. I like started typing it and I was like, nope, backspace. I was thinking about doing the same thing. And I'm like, you know what? I already have sketchy things in my search bar browser because of this podcast. It's fine. It's not worth it. But not great. It's not worth it. Not great. But I mean, I figure if you walk up to some underage kid on the street and say the things

[00:55:21] that are in that message or messages. Yeah, it's true. That they're going to lock you up. Yeah. You know, and it's like even if like, you know, you get some with Robert Branson or something like that, like catching a pedo and shit where they're like, they'll initiate a conversation. And then when the guy shows up and he's like, oh, there's a pizza party and there should be a kid here. They lock his ass up. He doesn't actually approach the child. We also forgot to mention. To be able to instigate. We also forgot to mention she volunteered at the school. She was part of the sports team.

[00:55:51] You know, like she volunteered. Yeah, she was very involved. Active with all of these kids around her. Gross. She's probably at like basketball practice texting them. Yeah, I guess it's probably like, I guess it all falls under harassment. I'm assuming, right? Like what you were saying, if you go up to a kid on the street and you say the things to that child that's in the text message, they will throw you in jail.

[00:56:17] But it's probably going to be for harassment versus anything else since nothing. You know, else happened. I don't know. I think since it was the conversations were more of an explicit nature. No, for sure. I think that they should have added that extra one on there and been like, yeah, we're going to give you another two years for being a creep. Yeah. No, I mean, I agree with you. I mean, I'm like shocked that there wasn't more emphasis on that. Yeah.

[00:56:45] But it seemed like something that the documentary wanted to get into, to be quite honest. Yeah. They were like, we're not touching that. We'll just talk about how she wanted her daughter to kill herself. Right. Well, because that's so much better. I mean, speaking of that, though, I did like how the documentary ended where it was her and the daughter talking about wanting to like reconcile or whatever, but it kept on like

[00:57:14] intercontinuing with like the text that were coming up. Yeah. I loved that. I loved that. A nice way to like end it. I'm pretty sure I read an interview that was done after the documentary with the daughter where she was like, yeah, I want nothing to do with my mom. So I wonder if she was just trying to be nice in front of the camera. Yeah. I am not built that way. I would have been like, you know what I mean? Like in the documentary. Like, absolutely not.

[00:57:44] Well, I think that like also the, like her being in that situation and then being able to take a third person look at it now growing up and actually seeing the repercussions of not only how, what happened to her, but everybody else involved. Well, and also seeing what other people are saying about it. She's probably like, yeah, wow, this is insane. What am I, you know what I mean? Do you think? Well, I mean.

[00:58:09] Well, I was going to say, do you think part of her agreement and talk about Kendra, part of her agreement and being involved in this documentary is that they wouldn't lay up that angle. Like if she set conditions. Probably. It could be. It could have been something like that at play. That's a good point. Because I think the real, I think the real sad part of this, this documentary also, I mean,

[00:58:33] not including what happened with Lauren, but like the fact that she's never going to be able to talk to Owen, like really ever again, or anybody else who was involved, like Sophia or Chloe or like anybody who would have been able to like eventually make bonds later on has this giant elephant in the room now that is never going to go away because it's her mom.

[00:59:00] Well, and because it's a small town and everybody knows everybody's business. Like it's in a state. She just needs to move. I was going to say, she needs to move and change her last name. That's it. Done. Like. Dye her hair a different color. Get a short haircut. Like completely change. Just be Juanita. Juanita. I don't think Juanita matches her. I don't think her, I don't think that adds up.

[00:59:30] Okay. Fine. It'll be John Juan Juanita. John Juan Juanita. But good. I'm glad that she's, because that was another, I think the, I think the ending of the documentary was frustrating, at least for me, because, because of the whole like reveal. Right. And then everything after that about how like, oh, like they're still trying to reconcile and they still talk.

[00:59:58] And, and even from jail, if you guys remember, like some of the emails or messages, whatever, that her mom was sending were still super manipulative. Like even from jail, she was still being manipulative. And like, and it just, I don't know. So I think I was frustrated. I mean, the whole documentary, I mean, it's, it's a, it's a really great documentary. It really is. Like, it's great. And it's shocking. But I feel like the ending of it was super frustrating to watch.

[01:00:26] Like, I just wanted to pull my hair out because I'm like, I don't understand. Like this. And like what you said, Michael, John Juan, whatever. It's, it's like, she's talking about reconciling and like trying to get back to having a relationship. And then they're showing all of these text messages that her own mother was sending her about how ugly she is and how she should kill herself and all this stuff. And I'm just like, girl, no. Like, what are we doing? No.

[01:00:55] You know, there are people that go no contact with their parents for far less. You know, it's, it's crazy. Yeah, no, it, I could not get over the fact that they were texting or emailing and doing phone calls while she's in prison. Yeah. But she did mention that she's supposed to have no contact with her after she's out. She should have no contact even in jail. But yeah, I don't understand.

[01:01:21] Well, that's, that's where I like, I'm like, why didn't they force her to go no contact while she was in prison? It doesn't make sense. Right. I think that was, that must've just been like a condition of her parole because she didn't get out early. She didn't serve the full term. And I think at least at the time of the documentary, she said she hadn't seen her in like a year and a half. So while they might've been communicated, they hadn't met in person.

[01:01:45] And at least then it didn't even seem like more was all that interested in meeting her in person. At least in like the latest shot. Probably with time and space. Time periods had passed. Yeah. Time had passed. Yeah. And to, to your point, Amra, you kind of brought it up a little bit. She was stuck in the situation. She wasn't looking at it from an outside perspective.

[01:02:12] She had been in that toxic environment and situation for so long that maybe with space and time and other opinions from the outside world, she probably now realizes how bad it is. And it's probably like, whoa, I should maybe never talk to her again. Yeah. Yeah. Because sometimes when you're stuck in a bad situation, you don't realize how bad it is. You like start thinking it's normal. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's just like you're normal every day. Yeah. And this is my crazy mom.

[01:02:41] It's not until you get out of it that you realize. It's just kind of like justify being in that situation. It's like a cognitive dissonance thing. Like you try and justify it to like defend your own psyches or something like that. I think that's what happened with the, I think that's what happened with the husband where he was just like, oh yeah, that, that sounds about right. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Oh, you mean she did? Of course. Great. Yeah.

[01:03:11] Let's. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. You know. He literally was like. You know. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Everybody was. I mean, I just think. You need to go. I'm going to call your parents to come pick you up and get out. Here's. He. They did call him from work and ask him to drive in. What we needed was like a microphone during that car ride back to that house. Oh, I would have loved it. I needed that. And been like. Yes. That's what we needed.

[01:03:41] That's what probably has the reaction you want. We need to walk to the car. The minute he opened the car door. The minute he got in and closed the car door and went. I just know that car ride. The radio was off and he was just going and cussing. And I, I just know. Yeah. Yeah. You know what would have been really great? If he would have, if he would have showed up and then they told him and then he would have been like, this, this could have been a text message. Right. He was like, I was actually making money. I'm making money.

[01:04:10] And you called me away. I mean. But I feel like their lack of reaction in trying not to be, I mean, I have a tendency to be kind of cynical, but in trying not to be cynical and assuming that they really didn't know, right. The husband and Lauren didn't know. Um, I think that their lack of reaction just speaks to the type of person that Kendra is that they were just like, well, she's always been, you know what I mean?

[01:04:35] Like, I just think that shows that, you know, she, she, she does seem to have a reputation because that, that other Kendra's parents, like her dad was like, she's a liar. And it seemed to be like intimating that it wasn't even just about this situation. It's like stuff that's happened before. Yeah. But see, I just can't get the scene out of my head.

[01:05:01] That's playing of like, let's pretend they're at home in the family house. They're sitting on the couch, like watching TV, like the three of them. And like, you know, dad's here, mom's here, uh, you know, daughter's somewhere in the room, but still watching the TV or whatever. And then like, she cool. Oh, I got to send a work message. And then like the phone and they both, you know, and then dad and daughter look at each other going, well, that's weird. And then they just keep watching the movie.

[01:05:30] Like, and daughter's like, Oh, it says kill myself. And she's like, Oh, I'm still working. Right. How do you not? I wonder if you could, can you, can you schedule the harassment on the app? I don't know about all these text messages. Yeah. What she was using was finger messages. And I don't know about that one. Yeah. Yeah. And that's, I literally just got a text message during this meeting.

[01:06:01] It's literally, I hope not. No, it's a good one. I remember it wasn't just more than she was texting. So she could have easily been texting like Owen during that time. Yeah. And we do, we all, I don't know if we forgot to mention, she did work in IT. So if anybody knew how to schedule stuff out, it would have been her. Yeah. I mean, she didn't know how to scrub her IT address properly up though. We didn't say she was good at her job. She got laid off, man.

[01:06:32] She probably got laid off because she wasn't working because she was too busy texting. Too busy trying to get her daughter to kill herself. I mean, crazy. And like also too, cause I know it was like, and Wilson, you brought this up and it's true because she was talking about, oh, like Lauren would come home and she would like turn to Kendra and all this stuff. I'm like, there are so many other ways you can build a relationship with your child. Like, why are we resulting to being the worst bully ever?

[01:07:01] Off the top of my head. Yeah. Let's eat ice cream. Right. Let's go shopping. No. Let's go shopping. Make a dinner. Yes. So wait, you want to make your daughter? No, no, no. And then you want to make her materialistic? Like, come on. I know. Like, first of all, you can't take the scenic route to be an asshole to your kid. Okay. You got, you got to, you got to be direct about that. No scenic route. No scenic route. Oh gosh. All right. Got to be direct.

[01:07:31] Got to be a complete asshole to your kid. So do we recommend the documentary? I recommend it. I think I recommend it. I think it is. It's, I wouldn't even call it a cautionary tale though, because it's like, I don't think this is common. I think this is super uncommon. Um, but I definitely think it's, it's definitely worth a lot. Well, it's a cautionary tale. I was very entertained. And maybe it's just a good example of like, when you're trying to like start for something,

[01:08:00] just make sure you don't get tunnel vision and focus on like kids and just like keep everything open. Like, if anything, everything's a possibility, but like, I don't really have an issue with how the school went about doing it. Cause I feel like they weren't doing everything. The school did a pretty good job. As they did it appropriately. And I know the parents were frustrated that nothing was getting done, but they were literally being undermined by the parents. Including Kendra.

[01:08:30] Including Kendra. Kendra was mad at them. She's in the office yelling at them, talking about you're not doing enough to stop this bully. And she's the bully. Why can't you catch me? I want to stop, but I can't. Okay. Can I say something? A total side note here. And you can totally edit this out. But Michael, do you remember when, I don't think we ever announced that I am married to Michael. That's why. No, we did not. We did not. We did not.

[01:08:59] I thought you were about to tell me that you were pregnant again. And I was like, damn. He is like shit. I know. No, no, no, no, no. No. No, no, no. That would be a nightmare. Wait, wait. Are you married to Michael or John or who? I think I'm married to John. Oh, really? She's got brother husbands. She's got brother husbands. There's three of them. There's three of them. No, but speaking of like, I want you to, I can't stop myself. I want you to stop.

[01:09:28] So Electra, our youngest, this is probably like what, two or three years ago. She was like four, maybe. She used to take nail polish and paint it on her arms and she knew it was bad. She knew it was wrong. And we'd like talk to her about it. Oh yeah. And then, so then she did it again. And she came to me crying with her arms behind her back. And I was like, why are you crying? What's going on? And she brought her arms out covered in nail polish. And she was like, I know I'm not supposed to, but I just can't stop.

[01:09:58] Mind you, she was four. She was four though. So Kendra's a grown adult here. But yes, it's just that when you said that, that reminded me. I forgot all about that. No, I remember because I was on a work meeting and she came to me and she was like, I want to stop, but I just can't. She like brought her arms out covered in nail polish. And I was like, okay. So anyway, in summation, don't be an asshole.

[01:10:27] You should be able to stop yourself and have some self-control. I don't know. What else? What's like the thing? Well, if you're like a normal person. Don't harass your children. Don't be like a low key pedophile. Right. Be like a high key. I don't know about low key. I don't need, I don't need the bottom five. Don't be an underachiever. I mean. Well, I wouldn't know because I, I, I don't feel comfortable Googling it. So I can't say for sure, but yes.

[01:10:57] Yeah. I, I, I would recommend this, but I would file this under the parenting guide of what not to do. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yeah. I, I, I think this would be a good, um, you know, for. Hashtag. Parents. How not to parent. Yeah. Yes. Just try, just try your best to not tell your children to kill. If you do the opposite of every single thing that Kendra Licari has ever done in her life,

[01:11:26] you will be an amazing person. It's the what not to God. Yes. Like, just don't do it. I love that. Yes. Yeah. You know, like the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy is the Hitchhiker's Guide to Parenting. Right. Just don't be a whopping asshole. Yeah. I recommend it, but I recommend watching at least twice. You want to watch it the first time, then rewatch it. You will get a different experience.

[01:11:56] And if you watch it another three or four times, different experience every time, different feelings, different anger, you will be yelling at the screen. You're welcome. If you're watching it multiple times, then you're taking notes. Like, just one, like two times at the most. I don't know, but don't take notes. I am taking notes. Look at all of my notes. Look at that. Look at what I'm going to. Can't wait to have kids. I'm like John Oliver over here with my notes.

[01:12:28] There's uppercut children. Mikey, do you or Juan? John? Juan. I will only respond when you address him by my full name. So please. John Michael Montgomery Cashin? Incorrect. Sorry. No, but I... It's Michael John Juan III. Yeah, I recommend it.

[01:12:56] I'll kind of go with similar sentiments. It's just kind of a crazy scenario that I truly hope is a unique situation that has not been repeated in other similar circumstances. But, I mean, I'm sure. But yeah, watch it. It's a thrill ride. But you can listen to the podcast.

[01:13:25] Pause it right until the spoiler. Watch it. And then listen to the rest of the episode. You could do that too. Yes, you could do that too. Yeah. So I guess watch it. It's on Netflix if you haven't seen it. And with that, I guess we're out. Until the next time. Adios.

[01:14:06] And who turned out to be the suspect shocked everyone. Thank you so much for listening to Get Docked. Make sure to subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio, or wherever you're listening to so you never miss a new episode. Don't forget to say hi on Facebook at Get Docked.

[01:14:33] We post a lot of updates, random thoughts, and probably way too many memes. Way too many memes? That sounds like fun. But also, if you got a documentary recommendation or you just want to say hi, email us at get dockedpodcast at gmail.com. We'd love to hear what you have to say. Until next time, thanks for tuning in with Get Docked.